Message-Id: <199805211346.IAA28408@zoom.bga.com>
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 08:46:19 -0400
From: "Quinn@GhostWheel" <someone@ghostwheel.mud.org>
To: quinn@netsville.com
Subject: GhostWheel Message(s) 831 - 860 from *ideas (#504)
Status: O

Message 831 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Tue Apr 14 08:20:50 1998 CDT
From:     Red_Fang (#5907)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  re: Classes


The reason the other classes suck is cause no one cool is in  them!  Mages
rock cause the got all the cool people in them :)  And then  Red Fang rocks
solo!

--------------------------


Message 832 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Tue Apr 14 08:53:52 1998 CDT
From:     Tarla (#18104)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  Mages, spells, etc.

Speaking as a fairly new Mage...

Glare has EXACTLY one use.  Boosting Focus by spending many many hours on jizo
glaring at Rexes.  ONLY rexes mind you.  A Raptor's WP is too high for most
begining characters to accomplish much other than getting very insane very
quickly.

The ONLY spell a mage starts with is glare.  Every other spell has to be
learned ICly by finding a mage willing to teach you a new spell.  You only get
3 spells total as a 3rd circle mage, they are all VERY low powered, and you
have to waste ALOT of crystals curing insanity constantly.

Nomar mentioned that mages get "restore".  Yeah... so what?  Do you know what
restore is good for?  Healing OTHER PEOPLE.  You can't use Restore on
yourself, and they way I hear it if you use it on someone else and miscast you
get thier injuries as insanity.  Potentially VERY nasty.

As I said before, a 3rd circle mage gets precisesly 3 spells, and none of the
choices are particularly powerful.  Not to mention you dont get MUCH of a
choice since what you get to learn depends on what your teacher knows and is
willing to teach you... that's provided you can FIND a teacher.  To get more
than 3 spells you have to get raised to 2nd circle (and higher).  Someone else
is better able to say how often THAT happens.  All I know is that it doesn't
happen much.

Hell, mages can't wear ANY sort of armor while casting or all they do is go
insane.  That means if a mage is going to cast a spell and some nitwit comes
along with a sword... ding dong the mage is dead.

Mind you, I fully agree that the other classes ought to get some sort of
advantages starting out.  I think we all agree that the other classes all need
serious development.

At present, subbies get gills.  Great... they can go undersea... and the
critters undersea are just as dangerous as the ones on land.. maybe moreso in
some cases.

Recombs get a second natural weapon, maybe an extra @nudity setting, and the
undisputed right to code thier appearance to look like some sort of animal.
Joy.  Except that you get zero control over which natural weapon strikes, and
you don't get multiple attacks.  Hell some of the recombs dont even have a
second natural weapon.  I had to pester Quinn for mine for my recomb alt.  As
an added bonus, recombs have thier stats @set for them.  And not in a good
way, believe me.  I had rolled a fabulous set of stats that were actually very
accurate for what my character should have been created with based on its
concept... other than losing most of the willpower due to dakirion
conditioning.  No such luck, the stats the character has now (in my opinion)
make no sense based on what the character IS and what is was created to do.
Ces La Vie.  One day when I have time I'll go back to trying to get my
character what it needs to do what it is supposed to do.

My point in all of this is that mages really honestly aren't any better off
than any of the other classes, and maybe the first thing that needs to be done
is the DOCS need to be updated to A) be accurate and B) tell the truth, the
whole truth, and nothing but the truth about the current real
advantages/disadvantages of each class... exactly what spending those points
to get that class really entitles you to, and what changes are planned for the
class in the future.  It might stop some of what seemi to have become
bi-monthly bitch sessions about how much more powerful this class or that
class is.

--------------------------


Message 833 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Tue Apr 14 09:10:49 1998 CDT
From:     Anubis (#22578)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  I want I want I want....

Claws and a tail.... that is reasonable isn't it? I'm a crocodile for Pete's
sake.

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Message 834 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Tue Apr 14 09:57:44 1998 CDT
From:     Tarla (#18104)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  Anubis

Nope, that's not unreasonable in my opinion.  No more inappropriate than fangs
(preferably poisonious, even if it's weak) and a tail are inappropriate for a
cobra.  However.... don't hold your breath.  What you are more likely to get
is fists and fangs, with an unusable tail, which is what Carlyn got.  I've
presented ideas on how recombs can be better handled a couple times and have
so far recieved no real response about it.  Who knows... maybe it's being
worked on... maybe it's been forgotten.  If those who recall my mailing them
ideas about developments for recombs could let me know I would appreciate it.
If only for the peace of mind of knowing whether I've been blown off or my
ideas are being considered.

--------------------------


Message 835 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Tue Apr 14 22:03:44 1998 CDT
From:     Rathe (#14172)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  Attributes

Change the bonuses (and penalties, for low atts) that attributes
(Str/dex/wp/agl/etc) have on stats. As it is, with stats as they are, +30
isn't really such an amazing modifier

--------------------------


Message 836 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Thu Apr 16 22:04:32 1998 CDT
From:     ShadowHawk (#12411)
To:       *ideas (#504)

I know it will _never_ happen, but I think it would be really cool for a
vampire class on here. When I go to MUDs, that's the only class that makes me
stay there.. My two cents. ;)

--------------------------


Message 837 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Thu Apr 16 22:05:38 1998 CDT
From:     Dante (#10660)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  No vampires, make Shadowhawk go away.

Har har har.

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Message 838 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Thu Apr 16 22:06:04 1998 CDT
From:     Mercury (#16576)
To:       *ideas (#504)

What would this vampire class entail? How not to drink blood messily? Fang
care? Sunscreen 101?

--------------------------


Message 839 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Thu Apr 16 22:06:42 1998 CDT
From:     Toraxyn (#19315)
To:       *ideas (#504)

Glue Dante's lips to Shadowhawk's left ear, and then jam a stick of TNT in
Dante's ass.

--------------------------


Message 840 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Thu Apr 16 22:06:47 1998 CDT
From:     Mercury (#16576)
To:       *ideas (#504)

Using straws in someone's neck isn't becoming in the gothic punk genre?

--------------------------


Message 841 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Thu Apr 16 22:07:07 1998 CDT
From:     Rathe (#14172)
To:       *ideas (#504)

i'd imagine nat weapon fangs, the ability to transform to an animal form at
higher levels, and a 'draining' ability.... But honestly vampires wouldn't fit
here.

--------------------------


Message 842 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Thu Apr 16 22:08:50 1998 CDT
From:     Mercury (#16576)
To:       *ideas (#504)

Titanium dentures for normal people to bite bite bite away at others.
Or wearable bear traps for biting.
Maybe the Generic Toothbrush to help keep away cavities and loss in the Bite
skill.

--------------------------


Message 843 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Thu Apr 16 22:31:02 1998 CDT
From:     Skywalker (#6644)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  Austin

Now, as I understand it, Austin was taken out of the picture because it wasn't
being used.  Now, I don't know about you, but I can think of at least two
areas that are larger than Austin ever was and if they were to be removed or
cut in half, most of the people here wouldn't even care.  Why do I bring this
up?  I think we should bring back Austin as an area accessible to players.
The way I see it, it'd be interesting to wander around the twisted steel,
hollowed-out shells of buildings, and the piles of rubble that I'm sure are
present everywhere you turn.  The whole area could be radioactive and require
radiation suits and you could even throw in some glow-in-the-dark people,
four-assed monkeys, and six-legged chickens for good measure.  What's that,
you say?  Austin would still be too radioactive even for rad suits?  Then pick
an area on the outskirts of town or that would've been just far enough from
ground zero to be lethal.  Or if that doesn't please you, wait to let a few
IC years go by.  I don't know, it's just an idea.

--Sky

--------------------------


Message 844 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Fri Apr 17 04:40:34 1998 CDT
From:     Abe (#21180)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  vampires...

here's an idea for a vampire, doesnt have to be a magic, soul-sucking
creature.. think sci-fi..
imagine someone with a disease that makes a normal human continue to have
their cells grow, that means they might have long, sharp nails, big sharp
teeth, (because of fast cellular growth)  and a iron deficiency in their blood
(maybe make it more like iron and nutrient deficiency?)
 now imagine if this subject has trouble eating normal stuff anymore, they
puke up certain foods or something..
 imagine a doctor who tested on some people found out that blood is one of the
things that can be stomached by these people, severe allergic reaction to
garlic, get REALLY sick at even slightest whiff..)


OR, some wiz can make an exception to a few players, and make a few
old-fashioned vamps...
sure, there are already gm exceptions around,. mage recombs/subs (mixed-class
stuff) , i wont go on with other examples, since it might be taken the wrong
way,
i think smoke's idea isnt so bad, of course, there are SOME drawbacks to being
a vamp tho..


--------------------------


Message 845 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 02:03:38 1998 CDT
From:     Smoke (#12541)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  well well

<OOC> Zorn says, "you know what I mean Smoke, whenever there was a person
 deemed 'twink' there was always a huge arguement that ensued, always."
<OOC> Ariana smacks Smokie for the Ari is a wennie comment :P
<OOC> Zorn grins at Ariana.
<OOC> Zorn says, "and people either left, or got sick of it till we're
 where that is at."
<OOC> You say, "You know Ed, I have been here 3 years now, and I can really
 say, this is the lowest."
<OOC> Zorn has seen lower.
<OOC> Zorn says, "but this is bad."
<OOC> You say, "Is it only us that sees it?"
<OOC> Ariana says, "No, it isn't."
<OOC> Zorn says, "not really."
<OOC> Zorn says, "alot of people see it, but what can you do?"
<OOC> Ariana says, "I know for a fact that both myself and Toraxyn have
 seen it."
<OOC> Zorn says, "the games entirely stratified due to stats."
<OOC> Zorn says, "no money so nothing of value."
<OOC> You say, "its crazy, nobody, nobody comes to play....they all enter
 in the safe corners....why is the punishment so harsh, I dont under.

--------------------------


Message 846 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 14:19:56 1998 CDT
From:     Mercury (#16576)
To:       *ideas (#504)

So what's the big idea about that last post, anyway?

--------------------------


Message 847 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 15:34:59 1998 CDT
From:     Smoke (#12541)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  re: Mercury's

The big idea? Well that would be that there are players that don't agree with
the changes to the moo as of late. I didn't post the whole conversation cause
Im to damn lazy. But if this is truly all of our moo then why cant we have a
meeting? Discuss what we see what is right and wrong, let our ideas be known
and get some structure back and perhaps some rping again.

--------------------------


Message 848 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 15:56:58 1998 CDT
From:     Mercury (#16576)
To:       *ideas (#504)

Don't know, those two posts don't make any sense.

--------------------------


Message 849 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 16:31:30 1998 CDT
From:     Moonheart (#20495)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  Problems here

I think the problems come from trying to please everyone and a general lack of
knowing where to go with Ghost. A meeting of lots of players will just point
out the different factions here on ghost, What is needed is to decide what
ghost is and where it is going then for all the Active GM's to understand
where it is going so they don't wander off in their own directions.

H

--------------------------


Message 850 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 17:24:10 1998 CDT
From:     Mercury (#16576)
To:       *ideas (#504)

So the different factions on GhostWheel aren't a problem?

--------------------------


Message 851 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 18:37:37 1998 CDT
From:     Dante (#10660)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  Reaping.

You know I just checked Executor's quota, even though you reaped some players
about 660k of objects are still wasting away in his quota, maybe clearing this
crap would suite the MOO more then taking up excess space?

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Message 852 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 18:50:36 1998 CDT
From:     Moonheart (#20495)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  Factions

are never gonna agree ..so quinn has to decide what this place is and make it
that then we fit ourselves to it not try to fit it to us.

H

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Message 853 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 19:04:38 1998 CDT
From:     Mercury (#16576)
To:       *ideas (#504)

Open up Morlith.

--------------------------


Message 854 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 19:05:29 1998 CDT
From:     Dante (#10660)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  Re : open up morlith.

Bring the nutcrackers and warm butter, I wonder what dragon sushi is like?

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Message 855 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 19:06:15 1998 CDT
From:     Baltisaar (#10734)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  Morlith

Its open... Just a couple gotchas...

1) Can you fly?
2) Are you on the menu for the dragons?

Denali

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Message 856 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 19:07:32 1998 CDT
From:     Rathe (#14172)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  I hereby declare..

That it is national dragon hunting day. I have ranged weapons and explosives
for all. Bring Your Own Undead.

--------------------------


Message 857 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 19:30:50 1998 CDT
From:     Mercury (#16576)
To:       *ideas (#504)

A shuttle can easily fly to Morlith, and I doubt that dragons are warmongering
beasts (or so DRs want people to believe that dragons are more high minded and
intellectual than other creatures) that they would blow any shuttle out of the
sky.
And if dragons would shoot first, ask questions later, I'm sure somewhere in
GhostEarth's past that someone would've sparred up an army and went to slay
all dragons for being a menace to humans.
They're well protected? What are they afraid of if they are so god afwul
powerful?
I think it should be opened.

--------------------------


Message 858 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 20:19:20 1998 CDT
From:     Entropy (#20188)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  Morlith

Why open it? I don't see that there's anything up there that non-Riders would
want...
Except for the obvious take-over potential, which I think is what this idea of
opening Morlith is about.
*grin* With Rathe and his kind around, you bet dragons shoot first and ask
questions later.

--------------------------


Message 859 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Sat Apr 18 20:47:06 1998 CDT
From:     Smoke (#12541)
To:       *ideas (#504)
Subject:  re: Moon's

Quinn is the deciding factor of course, its his creation. But I still think a
meeting is a good thing if handled properly. I don't want a bitch session,
just ideas and thoughts of players who really enjoy the rp factor of this
world. If the meeting is set in advance that will give us time to construct
our thoughts in text and paste em when our turn to speak comes about.

Things are just to out of hand now, no longer am I allowed to play the person
I have designed. The penalties of death are to great. I don't want to be
submissive to the godly state players, I want to play Smoke, but I cant. If
one player who is stronger then her has a hair up her/his ass I will stand to
lose skills that take so long to get. I think that this should be discussed
and explained, why is it the weaker should be punished? If you are going to
have coded combat then no penalties of death should be invoked.

--------------------------


Message 860 from *ideas (#504):
Date:     Mon Apr 20 22:18:07 1998 CDT
From:     Mercury (#16576)
To:       *ideas (#504) and *Chat (#5391)

Paintball for Ghostwheel.

--------------------------